Click here to deactivate Google Analytics-Tracking

3. Expanding int. effects with ext. plugins

3. Expanding int. effects with ext. plugins

3.    Expanding the internal X32/M32 effects with ext. plugins
        (What latencies achievable in what configuration?)

 

3.1    What maximum latency time adequate for which application?

3.1.1      Monitoring

              For InEar-monitoring, delay times between ‚singing into the microphone‘ and hearing, of about
              6ms are still acceptable. For speaker stage monitoring this corresponds to a distance increase to the
              speaker of 2m. This is acceptable. The same applies to FOH sound.
           
             *Only if (especially in small rooms) the FOH signal is delayed against the monitor signal
              and not about 10dB louder than the latter, the sound result will be irritating because it seems
              to come from the monitors instead of the FOH speakers (Haas- or precedence effect).

 

3.1.2      Guiding values for ...

  •  Vocal InEar monitoring:    <= 4-6ms
  •  Vocal Wedge monitoring:  <= 7-9ms (like 2,5-3m bigger distance to speaker)
  •  Drums & Percussion:        <=   6ms
  •  Keys-Piano:                     <=   6ms (like 2m bigger distance to speaker)
  •  E-Git:                              <= 12ms (like 4m bigger distance to amp)
  •  FOH in big venues:           <= 12ms (* see above) 
  •  FOH in smaller rooms:      <=  6ms (* see above)

3.2      Own Latencies of the X32/M32

    Every digital audio processor - and a digital console is just that - 
   delays the signal, at least for the length of the AD- and DA-conversion.

 

3.2.1      Latency console only
                  Analog Input – AD-conversion – Gate, Compressor, EQ, Bus-Summing,
              Further dynamics processing and EQ – DA-conversion – Analog Output:
0,83ms (48kHz)

         
 

3.2.2      Latency digital stagebox via AES50-Bus: +0,2ms (48kHz)

          


3.2.3       Latency internal effects of the 8 effect-slots used as insert within a channel or bus:

  • Combinator:                    0.67-0.71 ms
  • DeEsser:                         0.67 m
  • Enhancer:                       0.67 ms
  • Fair Compressor:            0.67 ms
  • Leisure Compressor:      0.67 ms
  • Sound Maxxer:               0.67 ms
  • Ultimo Compressor:        0.67 ms
  • XTEC EQ1:                     0.71 ms
  • XTEC EQ5:                     0.71 ms
  • Limiter:                            1.42 ms
  • Wave Designer:              1.42 ms
     

3.2.4       Latency console + dig. stagebox + internal effects:

        Analog In into digital stagebox to Analog Out of the same:
       (0,83+0,2)ms
--> 1,03ms (roundtrip latency at 48kHz)
       With "Leisure Compressor" as channel insert --> +0.67ms
       --> 1,70ms (roundtrip latency at 48kHz)
       1,03ms including digital stagebox, internal channel effects and bus routing,
       are an excellent result, not achieved by many of the remarkably more
       expensive digital consoles!
       Hardly any manufacturer of digital consoles show numbers of roundtrip latency
       in their datasheets, Behringer does!


3.3      Latency console + dig. stagebox + ext. plugins

3.3.1       (native) with "LiveProfessor" and "Multirack" via USB

Used personal computer:      MACbook Pro Mid 2010 (16GB RAM, SSD-Harddisk,
                                          Spotlight function (mds_stores, md_worker)
                                          and virus scanners deactivated.

Used effects (plugins):         WAVES: 2x Limiter L3-LL , 4x C6, 2x Doubler, 2x CLA-2A


Host software:                  LiveProfessor (audiostrom.com)
Buffer configuration:            32 Samples
Performance:                       DSP performance <70% (display LiveProfessor)
                                          Roundtrip latency of 7,7ms,
                                          adding C6 or L3-LL (1,3ms plugin latency): 9,0ms 
                                          trouble-free.
Host software:                  Multirack (waves.com)
Buffer configuration:            32 Samples
Performance:                       DSP performance <55% (display Multirack)
                                          Roundtrip latency of 7,7ms,
                                          adding C6 or L3-LL (1,3ms plugin latency): 9,0ms 
                                          trouble-free.

In Multirack a few more plugins could be activated, before audible dropouts occured
(meaning some more reserves, respectively slightly improved processor use).

 

3.3.2        (native) with "LiveProfessor" and "Multirack" via X-WSG-Card

        

Used personal computer:      MACbook Pro Mid 2010 (16GB RAM, SSD-Harddisk,
                                          Spotlight function (mds_stores, md_worker)
                                          and virus scanners deactivated.

 Host software:                  LiveProfessor (audiostrom.com)
 Used effects (plugins):         3x Vocal-Chain with WAVES plugins F6, CLA-2A, C6
                                           2x A-Git-Chain with WAVES plugins Renaissance Axx (Kompressor), Doubler
                                           1x Parallel-Effekt WAVES TrueVerb
                                           1x Parallel-Effekt HOFA AlgoVerb
 Configurations:                    64 Samples
                                           Soundgrid buffer of 104 for X-WSG-Card
                                           X32 configured to „ext. Sync Card“
 Performance:                       DSP performance <40% (display LiveProfessor)
                                           roundtrip latency of 6,1ms,
                                           adding C6 (1,3ms Plugin-Latenz): 7,4ms trouble-free.
 Host software:                  Multirack (waves.com)

 Used effects (plugins):          Like above, but instead of HOFA Algoverb, Waves
                                            Renaissance Reverb (sadly Multirack is not supporting
                                            standard VST-plugins), as well as an additional Aphex-Exciter
                                            in each of the two A-git-effect-chains.
 Configurations:                     32 Samples (!)
                                            Soundgrid Buffer of 104 for X-WSG-Card
                                            X32 configured to „ext. Sync Card“
 Performance:                        DSP-performance <70% (display Multirack)
                                            Roundtrip latency of 4,7ms (!),
                                            adding C6 (1,3ms plugin latency): 6,1ms trouble-free.

          A professional musician using InEars (voc, a-git) did not hear this delay (6,1ms) during a complete
          soundcheck afternoon and night concert!

 

3.3.3         Latency with Soundgrid-Server and "Multirack" via X-WSG-Card

 New horizons are opening up with applying external plugins on specialized procesoor hardware.
 WAVES is offering LINUX based computer hardware optimized for exactly this purpose (Impact Server,
 Server One, Extreme Server), running the actual signal processing, while the PC/MAC, running the host software,
 merely controls the system. This proprietary software-, hardware- and bus system „Soundgrid“ now is
 accessible for the X32/M32 family as well by inserting the X-WSG-expansion card.
 The control PC/MAC does not have any influence on latency times any longer!




Measurements taken show total latency times (roundtrip latency) of: 

Insert into (the in the X32/M32  6 possible) AUX-channels: +1,19ms!!  (--> for inserts in busses)
Calculation: Input digital stagebox – insert Multirack Soundgrid in main bus – output stagebox:
(0,83+0,2+1,19)ms
--> 2,22ms (roundtrip latency at 48kHz)

Insert into 32 active input channels: +0,86ms!!
Calculation: Input digital stagebox – channel insert Multirack Soundgrid – output stagebox:

(0,83+0,2+0,86)ms --> 2,09ms (roundtrip latency at 48kHz)
 

This world-beating low latency concept paired with exceptional audio DSP performance has its value and price:
About 550,-€ for the extension card and 750-900,-€ for the WAVES Impact Server, as well as the costs of
the plugins you want to apply.

 

Following a list of the most used WAVES live plugins and their internal latencies that have to be added to the
above mentioned ones. Stay relaxed, most of them don't add any or only small signal delays
!

 

3.3.4        Internal latencies of favoured and popular WAVES plugins:

  •  API 2500 Compressor:                       0 samples
  •  C6 Multiband Compressor:               67 samples (1.40 ms @ 48 kHz)
  •  CLA-2A Compressor/Limiter:              0 samples
  •  CLA-3A Compressor/Limiter:              0 samples
  •  CLA-76 Compressor/Limiter:              0 samples
  •  SSL E-Channel:                                 1 sample (0.02 ms @ 48kHz)
  •  De-Esser:                                         0 samples
  •  Doubler:                                           0 samples
  •  F6 Floating Band Dynamic EQ:           0 samples
  •  L1, L2, L3-LL:                                 64 samples (1.34ms @ 48kHz)
  •  Maxx Bass:                                      0 samples
  •  Primary Source Expander:                 0 samples
  •  Renaissance Vox:                            64 samples (1.34ms @ 48kHz
  •  S1 Stereo Imager:                            0 samples
  •  Vitamin Sonic Enhancer:                   0 samples
  •  Vocal Rider:                                     0 samples
  •  X-FDBK:                                          0 samples
  •  eMo D5 Dynamics:                           0 samples
     

Other than many a plugin manufacturer, who exclusively thinks about studio world only,
WAVES is developing optimized algorithms for minimum latency since many years,
always also having live sound in mind.
(List of latencies of all WAVES plugins:
https://www.waves.com/support/tech-specs/plugin-latency).

This quality, including their audio performance, led to WAVES plugins (at home in
the worlds finest studios) being available for most of the advanced digital consoles
by way of inserting WAVES Soundgrid interface cards.
Technicians of a lot of Top-Acts use them live (Find more information on Youtube)!

 

3.3.5        Popular effects (plugin) - chains

  •  Vocals:                                CLA-2A – F6 – D5 – Vocal Rider
  •  Backing Vocals-Subgroup:     L2 - C6
  •  A-Git:                                  Ren. Axx – API 2500 – Aphex Exciter - Doubler
  •  E-Git:                                  API 2500 - D5 - Doubler
  •  Drum-Subgroup:                  L3-LL - C6
     

3.3.6        Popular parallel effects (plugins):

  •  TrueVerb
  •  IR-Live Convolution Reverb
  •  Renaissance Reverb
  •  H-Delay
     

3.3.7         WAVES Multirack...

                                                                     ... is a virtual effects rack containing 64 racks.
   Each one of those mono (or
stereo) racks can contain up to 8 plugins in series.
   For native use the host software "Multirack" has a strong competitor with
   "LiveProfessor" which, quite similar performant, scores with higher flexibility
   and a lot more "modern" user surface.
  
   Controling Soundgrid servers however can exclusivly be done with "Multirack".

   Unfortunately standard VST-plugins are not Multirack compatible.
   The following 3rd-party-manufacturers offer Soundgrid compatible
   plugins: Flux, Sonnox Oxford, Plugin Alliance

   https://www.waves.com/support/soundgrid-compatible-third-party-plugins
 

 

 

3.3.8         Impact Server   

The smallest Soundgrid server, called "Impact Server" is achieving the above mentioned,
very low latency delays with applying 2-4 external plugins to each of the 32 input channels
of an X32/M32, depending on complexity and processing intensity
of the effects.
Together with additional highest quality reverbs and delays a definite "upvaluation" of the BEHRINGER-/
MIDAS systems.

Anyone realizing the possibilities for live sound, that are emerging here and getting quite excited
will not only supply an Impact Server for his or her X32/M32, in the long run he or she will end up
with the WAVES emotion LV1 mixer.
This digital software console is accessible via X-WSG-Card for use with the X32/M32-IO-hardware
infrastructure. Together with the above mentioned WAVES plugins an outstanding and most universal
solution for most complex live sound! But this is a new topic.

--> see blog chapter 4: „Next Level Mixing“

 

 

Recommendations to the costs of WAVES software products:

On their website waves.com for most of the products you can add a 10% voucher, that can easily be found,
when searching the web after „10% off WAVES“.
Or here: (;)):

10% off WAVES voucher

Add the found voucher code and save some real money.

 

Other than this WAVES voucher there are no agreements with WAVES (or BEHRINGER). What I've written here is pure own experience and
being excited about it!

 

Also the actual EUR/USD currency exchange rate (May 2018) helps reduce cost (at least for European citizens ;).